View Issue Details

IDProjectCategoryView StatusLast Update
0004124mantisbtlocalizationpublic2007-05-08 03:43
ReporterRJelinek Assigned Toachumakov  
PrioritynormalSeverityminorReproducibilityalways
Status closedResolutionwon't fix 
Product Version0.19.0a2 
Summary0004124: German strings changed back from issue to problem ...
Description

Well, the neutral definition ISSUE is changed back to PROBLEM.

TagsNo tags attached.

Relationships

related to 0005822 closedachumakov Change "Probleme" to "Einträge" in German version 
related to 0007647 closedvboctor [de] Translation change from "Problem" (problem) to "Eintrag" (issue) 

Activities

jkehrel

jkehrel

2004-07-20 03:45

reporter   ~0006166

I don't see the issue. Translation from bug in version 0.18 was "Fehler". Translation from issue in version 0.19 is now "Problem" which is more general. There is no perfect translation for issue (at least no one we found). The Oxford dictionary states:
Issue: a (point in question) Frage, die; the issue of the day das Thema des Tages; contemporary issues aktuelle Fragen od. Themen; make an issue of sth. etw. aufbauschen; the real issues in today's world die Kernprobleme der heutigen Zeit; become an issue zum Problem werden; evade or dodge or duck
the issue ausweichen; issue of fact (Law) Tatsachenfrage, die; the point at issue der strittige Punkt; worum es geht; what is at issue is whether we
should stay es geht darum, ob wir hierbleiben; die Frage ist: sollen wir hierbleiben?; that's not at issue das steht nicht zur Debatte; darum geht es
nicht; be at issue over sth. wegen etw. miteinander im Streit liegen; wegen etw. Meinungsverschiedenheiten haben; join or take issue with sb. over
sth. sich mit jmdm. auf eine Diskussion über etw. (Akk.) einlassen;

We had some discussions because the german word "Problem" is not as neutral as issue, but "Problem" is closer to issue than "Fehler" and the Oxford translation "Frage" is to vague and sounds "bescheuert" (to say it in german). Thats why we changed it to "Problem". If you know a german word that is short and applicable we will use it.

Yours Dr. Kehrel, Heidelberg

RJelinek

RJelinek

2004-07-20 03:57

reporter   ~0006168

Well, of course problem is more neutral than bug. But I dont think, it will be a good solution for the german translation, because why is a feature request a problem? So a proposal will be to use "Eintrag" (Entry) or "Report" (report) or "Ticket" (ticket). What about these?

jkehrel

jkehrel

2004-07-20 04:15

reporter   ~0006169

"Ticket" is no known german word except for railway or bus tickets.

We tried "Report" as you can see in the csv history, but that leads to sentences like "Report über einen Report" for "report about an issue". So "Report" was dropped.

"Eintrag" is new to me and I will try some sentences with this variant to see if it makes sense.

If you have more suggestions please let me know.

RJelinek

RJelinek

2004-07-21 11:44

reporter   ~0006218

Well, another idea would be the usage of "Meldung".

RJelinek

RJelinek

2004-08-05 15:51

reporter   ~0006664

I think 0.19.0rc1 is coming up soon, so I would like to send a proposal for german strings. So, jkehrel, whats your decision?

jkehrel

jkehrel

2004-08-05 18:06

reporter   ~0006667

I will be out of office for one week now. So I have not time to change strings before Monday, 16th of August. If you have time, change Problem to Meldung and we will try if it makes sense and what response we get from others.

Yours

EDV-Service Dr. Kehrel, Heidelberg

Wanderer

Wanderer

2004-08-05 20:11

developer   ~0006672

What about "Antrag"... "Anklang"?

sgrund

sgrund

2004-08-06 01:22

reporter   ~0006677

We use mantis to track request to our IT-Managent, so bugs wasn't quite right.
The new issue fits better. In our strings_german.txt we use 'Auftrag' (request).

docmarco

docmarco

2004-08-06 01:44

reporter   ~0006679

I don't know what's so bad about the word "issue" in german.
"Eingedeutschte" (taken from englisch and used in german) nouns are pretty common and we (Hanover, Germany) use the word "issue" among a lot of other english words in out daily german language. So I don't worry about "issue" cause it fits perfectly, even in german. And it is better than "Problem" or "Fehlerreport". "Ticket" might be the closest of all alternatives.
Why do you have such a high tendency to translate everything?

sgrund

sgrund

2004-08-06 02:51

reporter   ~0006680

I for myself can good live with english only. But we have many customers who wants to use programs in their native language. And a big issue is the 'political correctness' ;-(
IMO is Problem/Issue better than Fehler/Bug. So another translation to Antrag/Auftrag/Mitteilung/whatever isn't necessary.

bpfennig

bpfennig

2004-08-06 03:13

reporter   ~0006681

I started another discussion about some other strings 0004267.

I think "Problem eintragen" sounds better than "Problem eingeben".

dors

dors

2004-08-06 04:01

reporter   ~0006682

Probably the closest thing in German would be "Angelegenheit", but I seriously doubt it'll make for good and clear to understand menu texts: Angelegenheiten anzeigen, Angelegenheit melden... to me it sounds way too bureaucratic and abstract; besides it's considerably longer than "Issue".

If I had to choose between Meldung und Problem, my vote would probably go to Problem; after all, even a feature request is a problem you have to solve somehow.

RJelinek

RJelinek

2004-08-06 06:21

reporter   ~0006686

Before a longer discussion starts:

My only intention is: Choosing a definition which is neutral.

1.) Problem is associated negative.
2.) Problem does not fit for feature requests.

dors

dors

2004-08-06 07:07

reporter   ~0006687

After reading http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Issue I'm even more for "Problem".Even a feature request seems to be a problem for the person who submits the request.

BTW: Is "issue" really a completely neutral term?

RJelinek

RJelinek

2004-08-06 07:29

reporter   ~0006688

First: It is always hard to find a neutral definition and issue is better than problem. But thats the english translation. (which is not the case in this issue).

Second: So a request for an improvement is a problem? In this case we can left the word bug, which is also negative. Otherwise a neutral translation should be used. BTW "Report" or "Meldung" or "Eintrag" fulfills your and my requirements (although it is not the most neutral translation), "Problem" only fulfills your´s

rkrentz

rkrentz

2004-11-18 12:29

reporter   ~0008361

We were happy when "Fehler" changed to "Problem". It fits our speech better. I'm afraid we will not find a better german word which is more neutral.
Beside the words "Problem", "Vorgang", "Issue", "Task" we also use "Mantis-ID" as a self-explanatory synonym when we talk about 'it'. :)

achumakov

achumakov

2006-09-24 05:54

reporter   ~0013459

A philosophic issue for 2 years. I can't fix a bug when I have two equally right opinions. I'd better close it for now.

I think it would be better to raise this discussion in forums, and reopen a bug when a consensus is reached.

Thanks to all of you!